Is There GOLD In That There Lake????

Submitted by Charles Frost on Sat, 03/17/2007 - 20:39.

Is There GOLD In That There Lake????

Lake Erie Wind Map at 100 Meters



Lake Erie wind turbines proposed:
Just some excerpts from the article….
“A Cuyahoga County task force on Thursday proposed the Lake Erie Wind Energy Center, featuring up to 10 wind turbines on the lake and a research center on land spurring new businesses and jobs.
“There are no wind turbines operating on fresh water anywhere in the world. The plan calls for up to 10 wind turbines on the lake as a demonstration project.
The 10 turbines would stand some 300 feet above the water and crank out up to 20 megawatts of power. That's enough to light up 6,000 homes.”

“Erecting turbines and hooking them to the electric-power grid is estimated at $40 million. The effort would need heavy public subsidy before the private sector jumped in, officials said.”


Okay, I will admit that I am a little slow some days….  But a little question has been nagging at the back of my little pea brain for some time on this whole topic, and it seems to have finally made it to the surface….


****$40 mil for a “demonstration project”????****


>>> Drum Roll<<<<<


And, just how big are we talking about the final project being....., if this is "just a demonstration"????


*** disclaimer***

***I don’t profess to be any good at economics, or big numbers for that fact….***


Okay, I guess I am capable of imagining that I would want to spend say 1/100th of the cost of a project on a “demo”.  So, for a project that is expected to cost $10,000, I might spend $100 to make sure I had a working technology, a viable location, and a service department in my neighborhood....


That might be along the same line of a young teenager spending $200 on a bicycle to get experience commuting, driving/riding in the street, learning some traffic laws, and various other learning experiences before buying “the first car” a few years later for 100 times the cost.


So, where does that leave our “final plans” for wind turbines on the lake, assuming 10 Wind Turbines, 20 Mw of electricity,  and $40 million is the “demo”.


1,000 wind turbines is a lot of wind turbines…..


2,000 Mw is a lot of electricity…..


$4,000,000,000 is a lot of money….


….but what is the value of 2,000 Mw of electricity, for the life of the total 1,000 wind turbine installation – say 20 years plus???

...after all, "they" are making money on the 4 wind turbines in Bowling Green, and "they" are in a lot less wind than is supposed to be out in the lake, according to the 100 meter wind map that I copied above...

Maybe this is why "everyone" is interested in this, and not worrying about ice, birds, maintenance, and all those other things....

Is this the beginning of the great Cleveland Wind "Gold Rush"????


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View west from roof 650.JPG57.72 KB
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Why not 15 miles off shore?

It looks like the "best" wind is a lot more than three miles off shore, so why not do this right... right in the hot zone in the middle of the lake, partnering with Canada (where they actually have the capacity to get the job done, and from who we can learn how to do all this). Do we really need to see the windmills for it to be a big deal. The more I see about this the more I imagine a group of suits without a clue about advanced energy sitting around a boardroom listening to the wrong people saying "we have steel mills and bearings, welding and lubricant compaines and a port so lets build windmills" and then "best wind is on the water... put a bunch there" and then "3 miles out there is a bump in wind so lets put them there" and "the Feds don't want wind on Lake Erie but the Port Authority has a lease in one area so lets put them there". Where is the cartoon in the PD of one of any dozen political figures as Don Quixote, riding a Jetski? Jeff, you are on a graphical roll...
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There is a huge amount of wind energy on the Great Lakes.  Will there be a gold rush? Yes. So first:


Who owns those winds...they belong to the public trust.   And right now there are no protocols in place to govern or regulate wind turbines in the US or Canadian waters.  

Before any turbines are installed in the Lakes, we need an international treaty governing them, and providing for public benefit from the vast energy resource.  The winds need to be leased just like oil and gas and FCC cell phone spectrum.

Are the Cleveland "task forcers" really trying to get their foot in the water?

Or are they reaching too high  to preclude implementation?

 REALNEO - keep the discussion going!

Like Niagara Falls

Gee - internationalization... haven't heard anything about that aspect with this task force visioning before this string. Yes, Lake Erie is International Water (Canada is like in sight). Niagara Falls is a mega power source - right between US and Canada. What is a bigger wow - stopping the falls or posting a few towers in the lake? Niagara Falls. So why aren't we talking to Canada? Stick the turbines in the middle - run the wires each way - use their better tech and resources in this region - win win. Oops... now that we mentioned that here it will never happen. Talk amongst yourselves. taskers... any Edisons or Teslas home?

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if not internationalization how about intergeneralization?

If not for us, how about for the kids? Would the Intergenerational School be interested in this idea? Or how about Max Hayes or John Hay? What about University School or Hawken?

Wind for Schools: Developing a Model for School Wind Energy

How about a local funder or a person interested in education and renewable energy to teach the next generation about their options and entrepreneurship?

There is one project in Central Ohio in Lewiston. See the stats here. Buckeye Power, Inc partnered up with Indian Lake High School to install at 10 kW Bergey wind turbine at the school on May 12, 2006. The wind turbine stands on a 100-foot non-guyed lattice tower assembled by Indian Lake HS students. The project, including a monitoring system and specialized equipment was $70,000 with support from the Ohio Department of Development’s Office of Energy Efficiency.

I guarantee The Intergenerational School will!

Today my contractor and I were up on the roof of the future Intergenerational School - the former Hough Bakery complex - way up above the trees and feeling the wind. This is a good solid structure with lots of open land and no stadiums to block circulation... we can build way up. We are planning GREEN - LEEDS on crack - way beyond. We will have turbines - solar - green roof and beyond -  Geothermal - good solid building will be reused (won't waste any more embedded energy than necessary).

I'm counting on all the REALNEO advanced energy proponents to help max out the green side of The Intergenerational School!

As for University School... a former classmate of mine at US, who is an ultra-naturalist (and good friend of Green-funder Adam Lewis, who was also in my class there), was so pissed off at US for their lack of green consciousness, he wrote them out of his will... they are far from progressives. Let's not expect miracles and instead work with those who get it... for now... the others will get dragged along.

The Intergen will push this envelop... join the fun.

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ec green machine

when u r ready to put more green cogs into th ec machine, i would love the op 2 collarorate... but we may be already ;-)


You are

You are in the project as "don't worry about it - ZM's got it covered"! Looking forward to getting operational!

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